[00:00:32] Andrew: Welcome to another episode of Your Wealth & Beyond. I am super excited today to have Natalie Speers on the show. How are you?

[00:00:39] Natalie: I’m good. How are you? I’m excited to be here.

[00:00:42] Andrew: It’s kind of weird. I’m introducing you to my show, but in your studio, so it’s kind of that whole weird concept.

[00:00:49] Natalie: Yeah. But it’s super cool that we’re here because this is the first podcast I’ve ever actually done in my own studio.

[00:00:54] Andrew: And I love it. It’s looking great what you guys have really put together. So, with us this is the 35th episode and when we think about me starting this show it was built to help business owners and entrepreneurs build wealth and find purpose and I kind of do it selfishly because I can learn from those like-minded business owners that have done it and done it well and today we’re going to talk all things social media, digital marketing. So excited to have you here. So, when we think of that industry, like social media 10 years ago it didn’t even really exist. How did you find the passion to get into this industry back years ago?

[00:01:32] Natalie: It’s a good question. So, I’ll tell you my story. It’s an interesting one. So, about 12 years ago is when I entered this field of social media which obviously wasn’t even a term back then. So, what I was doing is I’m a native here at Scottsdale, Arizona and so I was working for a local entertainment company called Steve Levine Entertainment and I’ll pivot really quick. Andrew and I are in EO together, Entrepreneurs Organization, and Steve Levine is actually the current president, exiting president of EO.

[00:02:02] Andrew: What’s up, Steve?

[00:02:05] Natalie: So, that’s cool in itself. So, basically, what I was doing as I was working for his company back then, I mean, I was 20 years old and I was the only female events promoter here in town and so that was when Scottsdale was so different. That was when the W Hotel was just being built. Remember when Axis-Radius and Suede and Myst were there? And that’s it.

[00:02:26] Andrew: I miss Suede. They don’t make them like Suede anymore.

[00:02:29] Natalie: No. That was all that was down in Old Town. And so, my job was to get people through the doors of all the different venues what happened was I would then get paid by dollars a head of anyone that I could get into these concerts, venues, whatever the case was. So, that was when you needed a college email to use Facebook. That was when Myspace just came onto the scene and in 2009 that’s when Twitter was invented. So, all of these media channels were so new. No one really knew how to optimize them or use them. And so for me, I saw Myspace as a really unique opportunity to turn it into this basically virtual business card where people could come and they can learn about, basically, they could see how much fun my friends and I are having and then they could learn about all the events that I’m trying to push. So, what I did is I went and I taught myself HTML coding and so then I learned how to go on the backend of Myspace and basically code it. And so, I went there and I coded a data capture widget.

And so, what this data capture did was it allowed users to come to the page. They can then type in their name, their email, their phone number. There’d be a drop-down as to what club or a concert or events they want to attend and then how many guests they wanted to bring with them. So, when they submitted that, it would actually text message my cell phone and I would put them on the coordinating list to whatever was going on. So, what would happen, why they would want to do that is because they would basically save $20, $30 on a cover charge and they will get in for free. For me, I was collecting data and I would get paid $5 a person so it’s a very equal exchange. So, what I would every single weekend is I would go out by myself most of the time and then I would let everybody who signed up for my guest list, I would let them in and so they would spend more money than others. They get like a table or whatever and I get paid off of on that as well. So, once I got all of my people in through the door, I then went down the line.

[00:04:25] Natalie: Everybody waiting in line to get into all these different concerts, the people that were going to pay the $20, $30 cover I went and collected all their phone numbers so then every Friday I would send a huge mass text message driving everybody to my Myspace page and it was like a cycle went on every weekend so I was making a bunch of money and it was great. So, I remember one Wednesday, Steve called everybody into the conference room and I’m the only female doing this. It was all boys. Steve called everybody into the conference room and he pulls my Myspace page up on the screen and he’s kind of like, “Look, boys, look what Natalie is doing.” From there he gave me a department in his company and we called it New Media. This was before the term social media existed. Now, I have a couple of interns and then I ran social media. I bring him his clients for a couple of years and it was a lot of fun.

[00:05:14] Andrew: And so, Myspace this was back when it was kind of the pinnacle of social media you had like six-degree separation and then Myspace?

[00:05:22] Natalie: Exactly.

[00:05:23] Andrew: What happened then? How did Myspace start failing? What would you say with that regard as Facebook started catapulting?

[00:05:29] Natalie: Probably when Facebook was released to the general public, it wasn’t just about college students any longer. It was more, it became more of an actual social network opportunity. And so, it’s the way that everything shifts like right now you look at Facebook vs Instagram. Everybody’s migrating off of Facebook and they’re going on to Instagram but it’s not to say that each social media asset has its purpose and it has its relevant demographics which we can and do later, but I just saw that shift. It’s a very natural shift, right? And then Twitter came on to the scene. So, people shift depending on what the environment of the space looks like and what their overall need is, what they’re using social media for. So, interestingly, after that, I decided to leave Steve’s company and I started a different social media agency with two friends of mine, but still good friends with. Saw them last week actually and so because of all our combined connections in the entertainment type of space, that became our niche and so we had clients all over the United States and into Mexico, all the major entertainment cities. So, like Lago Restaurant in New York City, you have Marquee in Vegas, some clubs in Cabo, San Lucas. And so…

[00:06:43] Andrew: You were taking the data and the game plan that you had helped Steve and build out that and then you guys build that out on a national level.

[00:06:49] Natalie: And we built that out for Facebook purposes and we’re just collecting data and driving different leads for whatever the purpose was. And so, social media was so different back then. You didn’t have to pay to play. If you were smart and know how to optimize it, you could really get a lot out of it. Now, we know it’s pay to play. But that’s kind of the high level of my story. I saved up all my money from all the different promotions that I did with Steve and that’s how I started Social Ally, just completely grassroots from all the money I saved and yeah, I started out of my house with one employee in my house and then I had two and then I kind of just naturally grew from there.

[00:07:28] Andrew: In his passion to build in a sense two companies by the time you are what, like probably 25, 26, where did that come from? Was it innate from growing up with family entrepreneurs or did you always have that passion in you to build something?

[00:07:42] Natalie: So, that’s a good question. So, my parents, my mom passed away when I was 25 and so that was a year before I started Social Ally and so that was really a defining and changing moment in my life and it made me realize all these different things because obviously, those difficult things I personally ever been through but my mom and dad were both entrepreneurs their whole life. Before I was born, they had different retail stores and then after that, my dad still is self-employed and he’s really successful business and my mom had various businesses through while I was being raised so she could stay home with me and raise me until I think that I saw that growing up and it just became second nature to me even though it wasn’t like – I was so young. You’re so young but you’re subconsciously picking up all these attributes and behaviors of the mindset of a leader and an entrepreneur and so I think that that’s really what shaped me into the person that I am today.

[00:08:32] Andrew: And so, testament that you are successful like at 20, 21, and then you started the first venture, but you saved all your money. Most young college kids are right out of school, they would’ve seen the success and then go buy a car.

[00:08:53] Natalie: Well, I do get to tell you.

[00:08:55] Andrew: What’s that? All right. Let’s just turn it off. Just us?

[00:08:58] Natalie: So, I did start like one of the first golf cart businesses in Old Town. I bought a golf cart. It was like an existing business. It was like the only existing golf cart business in Old Town. I mean, a decade ago, wooden golf carts, the whole thing was coming onto the scene, so I bought an existing business for like $10,000 and this golf cart, this whole Rolodex of people, that lasted two weeks. That lasted two weeks and I sold it.

[00:09:22] Andrew: You were driving the cart too? Is that…

[00:09:24] Natalie: I drove it one night and I actually made a ton of money because people are just handing me tips like…

[00:09:30] Andrew: No way. That’s a shocker.

[00:09:31] Natalie: But then I’m just like, “These young people are crazy.” I don’t know. I was getting hit on left and right so then I ended up just renting out the golf cart for people. So, people would pay a couple of $100 a night to rent my golf cart and then it kept breaking down and then my boyfriend at the time just getting so mad because he had to keep fixing it, so it was a whole thing.

[00:09:50] Andrew: Two weeks, in and out? See, listeners, that’s smart though. She had this business idea, figured out this was a dog. Sold in two weeks. Probably lost about $5,000.

[00:10:00] Natalie: Well, yeah, usually.

[00:10:01] Andrew: We chuck it up. So, again, that entrepreneurial spirit right there. So, then you go and you bootstrap Social Ally. So, this is when, again, the infancy of things. You’ve seen that the data works. You are getting to understand how these platforms, how they’re working. Facebook at that time is really probably starting to go into overdrive now that the masses can get into it. So, when you start building out this company, you said it was just in a room. Did you have any employees or was it at that point just you and then you’re like, “I want to get away from just being in the entertainment field. I can help all businesses.”

[00:10:34] Natalie: Yeah. So, when I first started, obviously, it was just me. So, when I started Social Ally, I was a SaaS model. I was selling my social media management basically software, kind of like a Hootsuite if you’re familiar. And so, that was how the business started out and I got in with different groups that would kind of like word-of-mouth, would just spread, and people will come and buy it. Why I stopped doing that and went back to my consulting roots is because the amount of customer service that that required was just like insane. So, ultimately, that’s why I had to hire people is to run all the questions that would come in for the software. And so, I scratched that. That lasted, I don’t know, a little less than a year. Scratch that then I went back to what we’re doing now and that’s full service like consulting and management and all of that but that’s actually what the business started out with.

[00:11:24] Andrew: Could you build that software?

[00:11:26] Natalie: No. So, it was the software that I licensed out of Europe and actually took a trip to Europe and met this guy but I was friends with him through the previous business that I was a part of and that’s the management tool that we would sell and use to run our clients. So, that’s how I learned in being a relationship with this guy. This particular man, he’s doing really well now. He’s good for them.

[00:11:50] Andrew: So, when you started looking at these businesses out there, whether small, medium or large, what were you seeing at that point, just the ignorance of what social media was? At that point, digital marketing started to take a hold, search engine positioning, paid placements, but at that point, was your main focus trying to teach these businesses that you have to utilize this channel and you have to be the authenticity of who you are can enable you to step away from the competition? Was it more at that point, “I got to teach of what its value?”

[00:12:24] Natalie: Yeah. So, this is so funny because I haven’t talked about this in so long. So, after the SaaS whole business and I changed it, I was actually training businesses for a while and it was teaching them. But listen, social media back then was so different like the business was more like organic social media focused and you look at social media today, you can’t just go and post on your Facebook fan page and expect a whole bunch of engagement to come and everybody sees it because the algorithms have changed of all these different assets but back then it was so different and it was so easy to generate leads. It was like you could do that so easily. I personally love software so I had different software developers that I worked with that I would basically come up with the software from what I needed as a consultant or from a client from them and I would tell them how to automate at what I need in all of that.

So, I actually have my hand in building software that I would use in order to service my client. So, like I said, you’re talking a decade ago, social media was so different. I wish it was still like that but now it’s like you have to pay to play.

[00:13:31] Andrew: It must have been incredible. You obviously just put some content out there.

[00:13:34] Natalie: It was awesome.

[00:13:35] Andrew: Load it up with some keywords and boom. There we are. There’s 50 new people.

[00:13:38] Natalie: Yep. And I was constantly studying because as we know, social media changes every day, weekly, monthly. There’s always something new. They’re tweaking something on the algorithm. There’s always something to learn and so that was a huge part of it too is staying above the curve like, yes, I was an early adopter to the field, probably one of the first people and so that was a big deal to stay ahead of the curve and be just constantly learning and that’s something I have to do to keep doing now.

[00:14:04] Andrew: It’s in every industry. In building out the team now if you do that time to focus on the industry, the evolution, things of that nature. So, then when you’re building out and you start then getting clients, you’re like, “Oh my God. We now need people to help the service this.” How did you start finding the right talent as you started building your mission, your brand? How is that trying to find people that connected with you when we’re believing in the same thing you did and take could take care of clients?

[00:14:31] Natalie: Yeah. That’s a good question. That probably comes back to some early issues I had in the business. Probably had some bad decisions. I tapped into my own network of people and that is who I hired. And so, there was some questionable characters that I hired and then I ended up hiring friends which is awesome. I have nothing bad to say about it, but I personally would never hire friends anymore just because of the complexity and the perceived favoritism and all of these different items.

[00:15:00] Andrew: Are there any friends on staff right now?

[00:15:02] Natalie: No. So, my…

[00:15:03] Andrew: I was going to say you’re going to have to fire them.

[00:15:04] Natalie: So, my cousin is actually our COO but her and I operate on a business level very nicely and we have state boundaries between us, and so it works. It flows really, really great and so I don’t have a concern with that but just friends in general. I’ve been down that road and it never ends well. Yeah. So, early on, like I said, it tapped into my own personal network and those were the people that really helped me build a business and everyone no matter what my experience had been with people if it was positive or negative, everybody basically had a purpose in whatever my life path journey was and their own journey. It got them to where they are now and maybe they’re in the social media space too and they learned from me, right? So, everything had a purpose and so I have no regrets for sure.

[00:15:50] Andrew: So, if you were to talk to a business owner right now and explain to them the value of what a proper social media campaign can do, what would be a couple takeaways that we could talk high level on, on some of that value that regard not just for meeting clients, but building out who they are, letting people see that they’re real people but talk through on that and then we’ll talk around some of the areas or strategies that they can look at whether they’re working with a firm like yours or trying to do it on their own. We’ll talk on some of those strategies and then we’ll touch on some mistakes, a lot of mistakes we see out there on the campaign which I know there’s plenty.

[00:16:27] Natalie: Mistakes I’ve made?

[00:16:29] Andrew: Yes. Well, that’s a whole another show.

[00:16:31] Natalie: Or that people make in social media. I can tell you a whole bunch of mistakes that I’ve made.

[00:16:36] Andrew: That’ll be a happy hour show. So, we’ll talk to it like when you’re obviously a big company. They know the value of it but smaller companies that I know you still work with, how can we teach them of the value of having this as a funnel?

[00:16:49] Natalie: Yeah. So, I think that the most common thing that I see amongst people who are just getting into digital marketing or they have an existing presence but they really want to level up, the most common thing I see is people just expect to go on social media, start posting content, and then all these people are going to come knocking at their door for their services or their product or whatever it is. So, unfortunately, it does not work like that, otherwise, everyone would have a social media company until I think that the biggest thing for people starting off on social media, or the people like I said that want to really level up, what you need to understand is it’s like building a house. You have to lay the foundation before you can start building the walls and build up. So, the most important being is you establish your brand. Who are you? A lot of people don’t have for example branding deadlines, simple blueprints as to who they are and what they represent and what they’re serving people for and that’s a mistake like we think of Nike, for example. What do you think when I say Nike?

[00:17:58] Andrew: Just do it.

[00:17:59] Natalie: There you go. The swoosh, right, and the Just Do It. They have done a really good job of branding themselves, branding what they stand for and creating an identifiable and recognizable brand. And so, that’s the number one thing that I see people don’t really know who they are or how they want to be perceived on the Internet. How can you start marketing campaign when you’re not clear on your own identity?

[00:18:21] Andrew: Or who’s your avatar client? Who you serve best?

[00:18:22] Natalie: Exactly. And that’s a big one too. Yeah. And so, that’s super important before you start any type of marketing whether it be traditional or online marketing. So, step number one, create your brand. We can help you. I would say then number two is a huge mistake that I see as people go into it haphazardly and they don’t really have a plan or strategy. So, they have Joe Smith, their web designer, and they’re like, “Oh, hey, Joe, just start posting on social media. It doesn’t matter. Just throw some content up there.” And so, I see that a lot too. So, people are trying to, I get it, people are trying to bootstrap and like use their resources that they have internally at their business but at the end of the day, my school of thought is that’s actually hurting the brand because there is so much noise out there. We’re bombarded by commercials, by billboards, by scrolling. People scroll through 300 feet a day. That’s the size of the statue of liberty. That’s the average person scrolls that much. And so, when people are just…

[00:19:23] Andrew: No wonder…

[00:19:24] Natalie: Exactly. Carpal tunnel. So, people are just like so bombarded by all of this noise and so when you go into a marketing campaign with zero strategy, you’re now just a part of that noise and no one’s going to care, no one’s going to stop, and so you have to think visual disruption. How can I visually disrupt these people and make them stop to care about my message in my brand? Again, that goes back to creating an identifiable and recognizable brand. So, you see how all these kinds of pieces start to fit together?

[00:19:51] Andrew: Right. So, it’s not about just the quantity. We’d skip the posts out there because that’s ultimately going to hurt you. It’s got to have relevancy and it’s also got to show to break within that mold. Got to show character, right? Who you are?

[00:20:04] Natalie: Yeah. And that’s like the very tip of the iceberg and then you have to go into it because you think about it. There’s so many different social media networks, how do people decide what they’re going to use? It’s very overwhelming. You have YouTube, you have Twitter, you have Pinterest, you have Instagram, Google Business, Facebook. People start to freak out and every platform is different, and sometimes it deserves its own content strategy because there’s different avatars on each platform and so there’s so much that goes into it when you’re starting to strategize and plan and then organic it’s just one small piece of it. You have to also marry paid to have any sort of relevancy.

[00:20:43] Andrew: When you think about these platforms and that’s where you guys help business owners. Okay, you have Twitter. Probably not relevant for you. Maybe if you want to get personal and do some stuff there, but some businesses it’s great. Some isn’t, but what we see from my standpoint not knowing your industry that well, but when I see a company just last out the same content on their Facebook, your Instagram, your Twitter, you guys are just being lazy because those are the platforms that you should be using. Different audiences are on there like you should be using on Instagram the same thing as you would post on most likely on Facebook.

[00:21:16] Natalie: Yeah. So, like Instagram is a very Gen Z millennial-heavy asset whereas Facebook is more typically leading towards the older demo. So, baby boomers are the fastest-growing demo on Facebook right now. So, different kinds of content are going to resonate with different demographics of people.

[00:21:34] Andrew: And so, with Facebook as it’s evolved. You and I talked about we don’t want to really bore you guys but pixels, right, and things to that like just walk through when you have this ad and somebody comes to it and engages or maybe they don’t have to sign up for the call to action right to download the book or to go to your workshop, but what happens now? I kind of get all…

[00:21:57] Natalie: See, guys, this is good because Andrew is paying attention when I was talking to him about what he needs to be doing for his certain e-book.

[00:22:03] Andrew: My wife is like, “I wish you would pay attention to what…”

[00:22:07] Natalie: This is a clarifying question right now for Andrew.

[00:22:11] Andrew: So, let’s go. What have we got? So, pixel me up.

[00:22:13] Natalie: So, okay, pixels. Track me pixels. Super exciting everybody. So, basically, I’m going to use the case of Bayntree’s. I’m going to use a real case scenario if that’s okay for you.

[00:22:24] Andrew: We’re going to use a real case scenario, ladies and gentlemen.

[00:22:26] Natalie: For you. So, I’m actually going to give Andrew live advice right now.

[00:22:30] Andrew: This is going to be live advice. No cost.

[00:22:33] Natalie: No cost.

[00:22:34] Andrew: I hope. All right. Let’s go. What do we got?

[00:22:35] Natalie: Okay. So, Andrew has Bayntree Wealth Advisors. If you go to their website, you’ll see that they have a free e-book that you can download. What’s the subject to the e-book?

[00:22:46] Andrew: Climbing the Retirement Mountain.

[00:22:47] Natalie: There you go, Climbing the Retirement Mountain. So, when you go to their website, you can basically input your email address in exchange for this free book, Climbing the Retirement. So, let’s say that you whoever is viewing this have a free lead magnet that you want to do. You have a recipe that you want to give away. You have an e-book of your own or whitepaper or whatever it. And so, if someone hits your website and they find it interesting, they likely hit your website from a social media post or from a paid advert targeted to a very specific audience who enjoy climbing the retirement mountain. That’s a very type of specific person that would delve in that. So, they click on that ad then they hit your page. So, now you want them to input their email address so later you have the ability to, number one, promote them via email or, number two, you can serve that list ads depending on the actions they’ve taken. So, when they hit that page, let’s say they put in their email and then they download that book.

So, step one, they put in their email. Now, they get an email from Bayntree giving that thank you for inputting your email. Here is my free Climbing the Retirement Mountain e-book. So, now you got what you want out of that person and they also got value from you. And so, it’s a win-win scenario. You collected their email and they got booked. Okay. So, now let’s take another scenario. Someone hits your page. They do not enter their email, but you could see that based on your data analytics they’re important. You can see that they scrolled on that page and they stayed on it, one, two minutes. They had some sort of inkling to stay on it, but they didn’t opt-in, which is a very common thing. Side note, it takes people about seven times to make the emotional decision to opt-in or purchase something on the Internet thus why we introduce remarketing. So, that person came to your to page. It didn’t download so now we want to remarket to them.

[00:24:42] Natalie: Because they hit your page and we have tracking pixels on the backend of that page, we then can take their basically data and next time if they’re on the internet or they’re on Facebook, there’s going to be an ad that pops in front of their face. Basically, you can make this ad however you want, “Hey, I know you didn’t opt-in in on my site. Come back,” or it’s kind of like an undercover type of ad just to showing your brand over and over. The more that you can show your brand, the more that you can stay top of mind, the more likely people are going to come back and opt-in or engage or whatever the case is. And so, that whole thing is a high-level explanation of what remarketing is and we can kind of relate it to something that you guys can probably all relate to like you’re on Amazon or you’re shopping on DSW.com. I don’t know. And so, you add something to your cart and then you leave and you don’t buy it. Guess what you see? You see the same pair of shoes like floating around the internet and on your newsfeed so that is called remarketing.

And that is actually cheaper than just doing straight paid ads because you’re basically taking someone that you already push traffic to you and paid once so now to remarket then is going to cost less money if you already paid on the front end to get them to your funnel.

[00:25:59] Andrew: And we’re subconscious even though that’s like a Big-Brother-esque, this thing following me. I mean, there are ways you can stop it as a consumer but for most it’s just, okay, this is the world we live in now. But on that note and we get this all the time like Instagram like Instagram has been really good at with their ads. It seemed like everything that they put out there like I want that, I need that.

[00:26:21] Natalie: I hear that a lot.

[00:26:23] Andrew: And usually get it and it’s like it’s shit. It’s not what it is. But they do a great job at it. But what is this whole thing like if you and I are having a conversation about Nike and now if I go two hours later on my team, what if there’s a Nike shoe? Are they listening to us?

[00:26:40] Natalie: Yeah. So, for example, Facebook Messenger that we have on our cellphone, you know the app Facebook Messenger that’s listening to you, I mean, like you said it’s Big Brother. Unfortunately, the world we live in, fortunately, and unfortunately, it’s scary. I get that but I mean even your TVs are listening to you, your Alexas, your Google Homes. Everything is picking up particular keywords that are pertaining to whatever great partnerships that they have and they can push and sell this data and it’s totally Big Brother-ish, but that’s actually what is happening.

[00:27:13] Andrew: With a lot of these campaigns, we talk about tracking and analytics so you can use the analytics, Google Analytics or Facebook but what the value add that you guys have developed is being able to really show your client that return and I know the return sometimes isn’t about – it’s not just about how many clients we get, but there’s an intrinsic return of brand identity and sometimes as you said, it takes six, seven times. It’s that continued like they’re not ready to buy yet, will become a client yet but they keep seeing you and they see the real you. How do you then sit with your clients who were paying you real money and explain to them that, “Hey, we can’t show you a dollar amount today of how much we helped bring in, but we bought this type of value.” So, I guess the two points there. One is we can show analytics of how many were brought in that actually brought money to the table or turned, and then also then how we built out the brand.

[00:28:07] Natalie: Yeah. So, that’s a good question and I’m going to start that question off by saying that early on in Social Ally, one of my biggest problems was client retention and what I figured out was because clients were dropping off, because they didn’t understand the importance of the data that they were looking at nor did they know how to analyze the data. And also, we had a lack of very meaningful data. Everyone accepts data in different ways and they look at different metrics and so I figured out that my retention rate was no fault of my own. I just didn’t have the proper data reporting in place nor did I know how to properly communicate it, analyze it to that client. And so, I think to answer your question when we bring on a client, it’s all about setting expectations upfront. Let me understand what is important to you out of your time with Social Ally. What are you looking for from us?

What data is important to you? Is it email subscribers? Is it impressions? Is it reach? Is it comments? Is it sales? There’s so many different types of goals that can be applicable to social media and everybody views it in different ways and so that’s really super important, setting expectations upfront. Secondly is how we monitor the data is we’re monitoring every piece of data that we could possibly extract. We have all sorts of cool tools. Super metrics is one that we use that I love. And so, that is when it comes down to it, since every client has a different goal, it’s basically being able to dissect and deliver that data so that client sees value, ongoing value in what we’re doing. And out of the gate, I always tell everybody, look, we understand that you want sales for example, but those sales aren’t just going to happen tomorrow by turning on your social media. And so, it’s really a matter of teaching and setting realistic expectations for people.

[00:30:03] Natalie: Because at the end of the day, we can spend millions of dollars on Facebook ads or Instagram ads but that doesn’t mean it’s going to work right away. Otherwise, everybody in the world would be successful at ads. It takes a lot of testing, AE testing, monitoring the data, monitoring the creative, changing the headlines. There’s so many different factors that go into creating a sale on the Internet and that’s what people really have a hard time wrapping their head around because they don’t necessarily see all the backend type of work that goes on in order to create a sale. Now, once you find the formula and you find ads that resonate and you find fonts that resonate or I’ve seen up spikes in different product sales by having upfront on a picture versus a site profile picture. There’s so many different elements. So, once you find that magic kind of thing then you can start to create duplicatable processes around that. So, there’s a lot that goes into it.

[00:30:59] Andrew: You were talking about how to differentiate yourself from the feed. I think people are we kind of can smell out if somebody’s not sincere, if they’re trying to close like they go Glengarry, “Always be closing,” you can smell that if it’s not right so it’s that happy balance of having this realness for a company and providing some value, but not doing in the manner where it’s like, “I’m just trying to push, push, push,” because I think that’s where when you see also mistakes that, again, me as a novice, but if I see somebody just all about them pushing out them, pushing out them, then you’re just like, “I’m done.” Part of where building out the podcast is I learned from the people I bring on but we’re not in this case here, we’re not trying to bring on clients. We’re trying to push out good value and it’s going to hit different targets. This show today isn’t going to be good for my retiree client who’s 65 but for our business owners, whether they are do-it-yourselfers on the media side or they may have like an in-house intern, this is a type of value that we’re going to push out and they’re going to see, “Hey, there’s more stuff that we’re bringing to the table,” and that’s the kind of thing that I think leads to that brand awareness and that feeling that this company is there for me, not just for them.

[00:32:13] Natalie: Right. It’s all about creating value. If you can find a way to create value for your target audience, you will remain top of mind and they will follow you and then they will eventually buy from you. Buying on the internet is an emotional decision. It’s typically an emotional decision when you’re buying from others, and so that’s all about creating value and achieving great information.

[00:32:37] Andrew: Let’s talk a little bit about LinkedIn. I assume everybody who’s listening to the show has a LinkedIn profile. Now, LinkedIn started around the same time you got into the business back in ’05, ’06?

[00:32:47] Natalie: That’s a good question. It did start back then. I mean, I had to look and see what year. That’s a good question. I don’t know.

[00:32:52] Andrew: That’ll be in the show notes.

[00:32:52] Natalie: That’s a fun fact that I should know.

[00:32:55] Andrew: I know. We’re going to start all over. Let’s start to sell all over. Also, for younger millennials we’ll have a link in there about Myspace just in case you guys can go back and look at and see what it’s all about. So, when we think of LinkedIn, again, there’s good and bad of it. I get totally I’m just going to bend a little bit. There’s nothing more annoying when somebody connects with me and I’ll accept them, and I think you just fix there’s a way you can…

[00:33:17] Natalie: I accept everybody, yeah.

[00:33:18] Andrew: But then within the day, I’m getting bombarded with offers that I never lived without. Who’s helping us? I mean, that is the worst marketing. I know they’re blanking out, probably using a robo or something like that. That guy or gal is never going to make it, right, like that?

[00:33:34] Natalie: Yeah. So, that’s really interesting because we have a service like that. And so, first off, LinkedIn is a gold mine. I love LinkedIn. If you know how to use it properly and you know how to actually talk to people in an authentic way, where it’s not like this whole pitch and robo thing. The problem is that people are just pitching you right out the gate without providing any type of value to you so why do you want to listen?

[00:33:58] Andrew: Yeah. And then having two days later like…

[00:34:00] Natalie: Yeah. So, we have a similar service that we do here, but difference is, is that we don’t make it seem like a blanketed basically spam message trying to get…

[00:34:12] Andrew: Seems organic.

[00:34:13] Natalie: Yes. And so, I have a lot of clients that that is their only marketing strategy is LinkedIn emails and prospecting and we’ve run that for them. And so, that comes down to having a great copywriter. Me, I wrote the copy. So, that comes down to having really good copy and knowing how to connect with a cold audience that doesn’t know you and so that does not mean coming out of the gate and trying to pitch them on your service or your product or your donation or whatever it is. That means coming out of the gate and building some type of connection with them whether it be you went to the same college or you worked in the same place during 2009. I don’t know. There’s things that you can pick out of their profile and you can start to relate to them on a more personal level. Therefore, they now think that you just went through their profile and you’re not relating to them. So, once you can finally identify something that the two of you have in common, I got some people start to pay attention because they know, they perceive that you’re just communicating with them.

So, once that dialogue starts to happen then you have the opportunity to say, “Hey, I saw on your profile that you’re really interested in retiring at some point. I have this anything e-book that you may find really interesting because it’s completely applicable to you,” and then now that you just gave them something for free, now they’re much more likely to listen to whatever your soft pitch may be.

[00:35:42] Andrew: What are your thoughts on little snippet, little videos that we’re seeing more and more of whether that be on LinkedIn or engaged on Instagram? Is that the future to with our attention spans, with the show, we’re going to have people that listen to while in a gym and so forth but like overall to have somebody listen 50 minutes versus two, what do you think in that scope for people that can try to get their message out in a concise manner and making it engaging?

[00:36:07] Natalie: Yeah. So, that’s a really interesting question because I have a few different clients that Instagram on newsfeed, on profile video works really well for them and they get a ton of engagement. And let’s say they have a couple of hundred thousand followers. Then I have another client that has a couple hundred thousand followers and video does not work for them on their newsfeed. Static graphics only work. And so, it’s going to be applicable to the audience that’s following you, but I will say that video, Facebook predicts that everything’s going to video in 2020 next year. Everything will lead towards video. And I think that video is awesome and people need to be doing as much video as they can and start getting comfortable in front of the camera. It took me a really long time to get comfortable in front of the camera. It just does and that’s practicing that you need to do, but video, Instagram stories is where it’s at right now.

Instagram stories are just on fire right now and I see so many different products and services being sold through authentic humanizing real video of people just talking on their Instagram feed, telling them what a day in life look like, what’s something that I can provide a value to you, a tip that I learned today, something I did wrong maybe I can help you prevent or whatever the case. So, that’s really powerful and I encourage people to get comfortable with that because that’s where everything is going.

[00:37:26] Andrew: It doesn’t have to be this well-produced video. They can be one like you said grab a phone, got a thought. Someone in our group, he’s very good at that. He just grabs his phone and his hair is everywhere and he just has a message he wants to get out and that’s like realness that you can’t fake.

[00:37:44] Natalie: Exactly. And people can see that. They can feel your energy on that and they know it’s true and that’s humanizing you and that’s piquing interest because they’re genuinely interested in what you’re saying and you completely just humanize you and your business.

[00:37:58] Andrew: And it’s not like on that take. You don’t have to have a swipe up or link here. You don’t always have to be pushing out and saying, “Go here.” It’s you have to pick and choose your battles in that scope. We had talked a while back on Facebook and when you have like let’s talk YouTube a little bit than Facebook. So, YouTube is the second-fastest or the second largest search engine.

[00:38:22] Natalie: Yup.

[00:38:22] Andrew: Okay. So, think about that, listeners. Google number one but Google, which owns YouTube, is number two. So, video is where it’s at. Correct?

[00:38:30] Natalie: Yup.

[00:38:30] Andrew: And then when we think about then the content within that video being able to then use that as a second hub, that’s going to help your organic rankings?

[00:38:38] Natalie: Right. So, everything that you do, you should think about how you can repurpose it. So, we take this right now, this podcast that we’re doing right now. You can take this. You can slice it up into small little pieces of content under one minute for Instagram newsfeed. You can take it and you can post it on YouTube. You can post it on your website. You can get a transcription of everything that we’re saying right now in this podcast and you can do a blog on your website and embed it which is really good for SEO and keywords. So, there’s so many different use cases for all the content you’re creating, repurpose, repurpose, repurpose.

[00:39:15] Andrew: Yeah. The hard part or the heavy lifting is doing the podcast.

[00:38:19] Natalie: It’s doing it, right? Yeah.

[00:38:20] Andrew: Doing the blogs.

[00:39:20] Natalie: It’s putting in the hour to converse.

[00:39:22] Andrew: But then like we talked about too like the challenges of now this would be a 35th show and then we also have videos on but now it’s like repackaging that and repurposing it and doing it and that’s something that you can’t do it on your own. You need to have a team to do it and the neat part is that if you know your audience, you could build snippets that focuses on the 45-year-old and the snippet that focuses on the 58-year-old and then be able to market it and then be able to attract that one, correct?

[00:39:46] Natalie: That’s right. Yeah.

[00:39:47] Andrew: So, when we look at Facebook and let’s say this podcast was posted on YouTube. So, in the past what we’ve done is we’ve used my marketing team would post it on Facebook but then build the LinkedIn to YouTube. You are saying that it’s smarter, more engaging, more hopefully with followers or people will see it is if they actually upload the MP4 file?

[00:40:08] Natalie: Right. So, every social platform wants you to stay on their social platform. It doesn’t be good then for you to be on Facebook and click a YouTube link and then to taking you off of Facebook, right? So, the way that the algorithms run, the way the content is shown to the consumer is based on native content. So, when we’re doing this podcast you’re going to want to put this file on its own on YouTube and then you’re going to want to take it and natively upload it to Facebook because Facebook’s algorithm is going to favor its own content on its own platform over an external link that is taking you off of Facebook and that’s just the way that the algorithm works.

[00:40:47] Andrew: And this whole algorithm just like the Google search index, how that is one where you’ll do your research, but at the end of the day, you guys don’t know what’s happening.

[00:40:56] Natalie: It’s constantly changing.

[00:40:57] Andrew: So, for you, it’s just trial and error, and then all of a sudden you figured it out the secret sauce and then will just turn the switch on you.

[00:41:04] Natalie: Yeah. A lot of it, I mean, you can research it but it’s constantly changing and so that research may be outdated or whatever the case is and so we do a ton of testing all the time and so we just tested this. I had this theory about the YouTube link on Facebook like a couple of months ago. The account manager has actually texted it out there because they needed to prove it to the client because the client wanted the YouTube link posted on Facebook instead of natively, the video natively on Facebook. Our theory was you’re not going to get as much bang for your buck. So, we tested our polls and we let the data speak for itself. So, no one can refute the data. The data is the best.

[00:41:41] Andrew: And who won that contest?

[00:41:43] Natalie: Well, Social Ally won the contest.

[00:41:45] Andrew: There you go. As you knew that would be the case. So, I guess all these platforms, would you say LinkedIn if used correctly, goldmine, can be.

[00:41:54] Natalie: Absolutely.

[00:41:55] Andrew: In one industry and then Instagram moving more towards the younger audience.

[00:42:02] Natalie: Yeah. Instagram stories. If you’re not using Instagram stories that’s something that you need to definitely look into and research for sure. Unfortunately, you have to have 10,000 followers to be able to embed a swipe up feature in your story and so that’s a goal that everyone should strive for because that’s a big deal. Like for example, you posted a clip of a podcast today, a 15-second teaser and you said, you could say, “Swipe up to watch,” and it leads you exactly to where that podcast is hosted but you have to have 10,000 followers to do it.

[00:42:32] Andrew: Got it. I always wondered how like Rolling Stones could have that and they link you to their one page that have all the links to it. Instagram, if you have to kind of understand how it works, it’s not that easy to link out because like you said, they want to keep you in their world. So, we think about you as growing this business, so it’s kind of flipped and shipped over to business owner at and you started this business because you had a passion for it and you’re like we can help these businesses and this whole infancy of an industry which social media was not now anymore. You kind of we’re in the forefront of that. Now, you become this business owner. So, you got how many employees here at Social Ally? Is it 20-ish?

[00:43:09] Natalie: Yeah. No longer 20, A lot.

[00:43:12] Andrew: Too many sometimes? So, as you become an accidental business owner, what are some of the ways in how you continue to try to become a good leader? What are you doing to not just drive the mission of the company, helping your clients, but what are you doing to make sure that it’s a great place to work and people believe in your vision and wanting to go on the ride with you?

[00:43:33] Natalie: So, I was on Facebook this morning when I was laying in bed about to get up and Daymond John posted something that really got me thinking and what he said was 83% of businesses fail and 1% of businesses turn into multimillion-dollar businesses. So, think about that for a second. Like where are you? That’s pretty cool because we fall into that 1% category and that’s a really surreal thing for me to wrap my head around because this business has probably been the hardest thing that I ever done. I’ve never really publicly talked about like all the different struggles and people that come in and take advantage of me and sued me and all different things that I have been through as a business owner. I think that I’ve had been closely giving it up four times and…

[00:44:23] Andrew: What do you mean by it? So, you literally throw in the towel?

[00:44:25] Natalie: Throwing in my hat. Yeah.

[00:44:27] Andrew: Just through people taking advantage or just the stress?

[00:44:31] Natalie: Yes, both. The stress is unreal and people, you think of it, you see all these little memes out there. You think of it as an iceberg and so people see the tip of the iceberg through the water. No one sees the iceberg underneath the water and so when people look at me, they look at me that, “Oh, she owns this awesome business. Her life is so easy. She’s making this money, this and that.” It’s just not true like no one understands. I to be honest with you, didn’t start paying myself until recently and I’ve had this business for six years. I’ve never said that publicly but there you go. I just said it on your podcast.

[00:45:08] Andrew: Nobody is listening anyway so…

[00:45:10] Natalie: And so, it’s just extremely high-stress thing that people don’t really understand until they actually go through it. And so for me, that’s one of the reasons that I joined EO is to be able to be part of the community in which people are going to the same trials and tribulations as I am because it’s hard when you talk to your friends or your family. They’re not self-employed. They don’t own a business. They can’t possibly understand the mental anguish and the emotional roller coasters that you go through. And so, I am by no means a perfect leader. I still have a lot of learning to do and I do research and read a lot. I think that one of the most important things to me as a leader is the culture that you build with the people that are a part of your team because at the end of the day without your team, you have nothing. You have you. You have the dancing bear that everyone’s paying for, right? They’re paying for Natalie, the dancing bear.

So, that’s not a scalable long-term thing to be able to run a business and so like I said, so culture is really important to me. I like to keep it fun around the office but also maintain a level of professionalism and people actually getting their work done and I think that that is what we have here. I think that learning how to spot talent is something that’s really important too. I think that leaders will always rise to the top. A lot of times people don’t realize that they’re a leader, and it’s a matter of mentoring them and bringing that out in them and they always rise to the top and they always shine. And so, I think that that’s a really interesting thing. I think being a mentor and not a preacher is really important. Now, it’s not to say that I don’t get pissed off because I do. It’s really hard for me when like my team makes mistakes, but everyone makes mistakes. I make mistakes all the time. And so, it’s a matter of figuring how to best communicate and help that person work through it and being a mentor and not like I said, a preacher or a dictator. I think that that’s really important.

[00:47:13] Natalie: I think that giving credit to your team when credit is due is really important. People want to feel a part of something that’s bigger than them and that they’re contributing. And so, that gives people a purpose and so I think that’s really important and then basically, I would say having confidence in your decisions when you’re a leader, people are looking up to you and they’re looking to you for guidance and decision-making. And so, for a long time, it was hard for me to make decisions and just really like show confidence in that because it’s a scary thing like you’re making real decisions that based on like real money or real people’s business or whatever the case is. So, showing confidence in those types of things is really important too, and then my biggest problem was delegation for a really long time. I just want to take over and like do everything so I can feel like I can do ten times faster. Well, that’s a huge problem that I finally overcame and being able to delegate. Because at the end of the day, I can’t do it all. You can’t do it all. It’s impossible as you’d be working your whole life with no life.

[00:48:19] Andrew: That’s most entrepreneurs say especially as they’re growing their company, they think they can do it better and it’s not the case. You got to empower and just being able to let go and let somebody else run with it, it’s also refreshing when it actually happens and you have the right team and they’re doing things better than you would’ve done. There’s a lot of things that my team does better than I do and they get excited when I’m always going away for a few days. A week keeps going because they get things done. So, it’s that fine line of not micromanaging and respecting and trusting your team. It’s great. So, I was thinking of this question on the way up here. If you let’s just say, remember seeing Back to the Future, your 75-year-old self came down from wherever and they said to you about your life, “Here’s what you did,” what would you want that conversation look like?

[00:49:12] Natalie: My gosh. That’s an intense question. I think that if someone was telling me about my life, I think that I would want to know that I treated people the way that they deserved to be treated which is I would want to say that I was a grateful person, that I manifested my own reality, which I did and that I – this is so hard that family is really important to me so I want to have some element of family in there that I had like this immediate family unit which I do, my extended and my immediate family, but my future family that I want be able to leave. If I have children, I want to be able to leave a legacy for them, something that they can be proud of when I pass on that I did something amazing and I helped people in whatever way that looks like. That’s what I would want to be said.

And I have one client right now, in particular, that is a Christian business and every day we get hundreds of comments saying these like amazing comments saying about how our particular like service and social media content has somehow helped them in their life either find their faith or recover from drug addiction or whatever case is. We see all types of scenarios. When I read those comments, that’s a really cool thing because literally our team is impacting lives and saving lives and doing these amazing things. So, when I think back on my life, I would want to leave that legacy that we as a team made a personal impact on someone’s life.

[00:50:53] Andrew: I love it. Great answer. When you think about what you’re doing day in and out and the stresses and everything and like you said, everyone sees the top part, the beautiful office and the staff. They don’t really look at all the blood, sweat, and tears it took to get here and what now that you guys are on that mission to continue growing it, and now to your point where you can grow it the right way work with the clients that you want to work with. I mean, how nice is that to be able to turn away and that’s something when we both got started, I could’ve taken on every client and now it’s just like somebody will come to me and somebody can come to you guys who are willing to pay for your service but if you know deep down that they’re not the right fit or they’re just going to be a pain whether or not going to believe in your philosophy, allowing you to lead them where they need to go, you know that relationship is dead in the water. So, being able to then accommodate and build your team and build your vision, build your company so you can do all those things, that’s what being an entrepreneur is all about. So, thank you for sharing on that.

So, as we come to a close, I know we went over a lot. We said it all. I didn’t know you had the golf cart thing. This is amazing.

[00:52:00] Natalie: This podcast is good. You got some golden nuggets that I have really never been released or nor have I talked about.

[00:52:06] Andrew: We know how to get it out of you. But as we end today for the listener out there, just one or two things that they should do starting today to get their social media on track and in the notes too will be a way for them to contact you, guys to see you guys do it where it’s just like, “Let’s just do an assessment. Let’s find out where you are, where you want to be,” and then intentionally see if it aligns with helping?

[00:52:28] Natalie: Yeah. I don’t offer that but I’d be willing to do it for your podcast listeners some sort of social media audit of what they’re doing right now and how they basically could optimize it, I’d be willing do that but I think that leaving you with this is I mentioned the importance of monitoring data and monitoring analytics. I think that the most important thing you can start doing right now is, number one, I got Google Analytics, your website, most people surprisingly, haven’t even looked at that nor know how to operate it. So, whoever is running your website can do that. And then, number two is when you’re posting on Instagram or Facebook or whatever the case is, start looking at the insights. Facebook has an insight tab. Instagram has an insight tab. By the way, you need to make you Instagram a business account, not a personal to see the insights tab. So, you’re going to start to see a pattern and whatever that pattern is, is going to be based upon what content you’re syndicating. So, you may be syndicating blogs everyday or blogs in different types of memes or video or whatever. And you think that one is really resonating then you should continue that with your content stream.

Well, guess what, the insights might tell you something completely different and so that’s going to basically tell you that you need to pivot your strategies. So, that’s what I’ll leave you with. I think the number one thing is you need to monitor your data in order to have a continued solid strategy.

[00:53:47] Andrew: Great advice and I think the other thing, I’ll take away is be authentic. Don’t be somebody you’re not because in real life, you can’t hide and on the digital platform people are going to sniff it out. Be authentic everybody. Well, Natalie, it’s been awesome.

[00:54:02] Natalie: Thank you. Thanks.

[00:54:03] Andrew: You crushed it. I really appreciate the time. So, listeners, we got a lot of great nuggets in here. It’s going to be in the show notes everything we went through and stay tuned for another episode of Your Wealth & Beyond coming up later this month. Happy planning, everybody. We appreciate you. Thank you.

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Thank you for joining me for today’s episode of Your Wealth & Beyond. To get access to all the resources mentioned during today’s podcast, please visit Bayntree.com/Podcast, and be sure to tune in later this month for another episode of Your Wealth & Beyond.
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